Optimising GTA:VC Graphics Engine - a Guide

[Guest]

This is a guide to getting the outdated GTA:VC graphics engine looking it's best.

1. First of all, go to your GTA:VC directory. Right-click on the gta-vc.exe file then select Properties->Compatibility tab and select "Run this program in compatibility mode for: Windows 98 / Windows Me". This does two things. Firstly is stops distance drawing problems so that you can always see into the distance. Secondly when you turn the frame limiter off it stops the "loading..." screen from popping up.

2. (Radeon cards only) To stop screen ripping you need to enable VSync. Go to Start->Settings->Control Panel->Display->Settings->Advanced->Direct3D. Make Wait for Vertical Sync "Always On". While your there crank up your Anti-Aliasing and Anisotropic Filtering to smooth off the jaggies. Having them set to "Application Preference" means they're not gonna be used.

3. Make sure your monitor is running at full refresh rate. Believe it or not, Radeon cards work in a different refresh rate when you are running in Direct X mode. So you may think your running at a high rate, but as soon as you play a game it goes back down to a lower rate. Go to the Start->Settings->Control Panel->Display->Settings->Advanced->Displays tab and select your monitor. Then select "DirectX Override Refresh Rate" and crank it to it's highest. Say 85 to 90 Hz or higher if you can.

4. Run GTA:VC, go to OPTIONS->DISPLAY SETUP. Crank up the draw distance. Turn the frame limiter off!!! Set your resolution to 1024 x 768 x 32.

5. Play the game.

You may have to adjust some of the settings to suit your card and processor.

You have never seen Vice City look so damn good now have you?

[Agret]

Haha thats cool, but we like our "Outdated GTA:VC Engine" beacuse we have our "Outdated Computers"

[Guest]

Hey I'm as broke as the next guy but I don't skimp on my PC's. My car is shit cos I spend my money on PC's. A Radeon 9800 Pro is a nice card and expensive, but now with the Radeon 9600 XT you can get a midrange card for with decent performance and price.

Anyway that trick to turn on Win98 Compatibility mode works for anyone using Windows XP and really improves the display performance. That stupid frame limiter is crap. Who wants to run games at a 30 fps cap, this is a PC market not a PS2 market for shit sake!

So go without food and live in a cardboard box for a month or two with a sign around your neck "Will work for Radeon 9800 XT" and hopefully you can get one

[Blokker_1999]

and do the reverse if you play MTA

MTA does not work in Win98 comp mode since it does not work in Win98

Keep the framelimiter on. It will load the maps faster since the framerate is limited and less cpu power and gpu power is used

And what is up with the resolution, ppl with a TFT screen can't even choose and if you got a slow computer u need to turn down the resolution or u get a low framerate.

All this guide does is trying to get u a high fps rate and the only reason it looks better is because you enable Anti-aliassing and antistropic filtering which can also be set on nvidia cards

[Guest]

It does work for MTA... But only turn on the compatibility mode for the Vice City game executable not any MTA files.

If you think 30 fps is good enuf then by all means turn the frame limiter on. Personally I don't have a problem with maps loading when I turn on the compatibility mode to 98.

As for TFT screens, obviously if you cant use the resolution, try a different one. It is just a guide. I'd be stupid to try and write it for every combination of every piece of hardware out there.

Of course it looks better with AA and AF, and better framerate. Thats the whole point to my post!

Edited December 20, 2003 by Guest

[Blokker_1999]

first of all : u r in the MTA:VC forums section. Win98 comp mode is not benefitial for MTA:VC, neither is turning off the framelimiter.

The only reason why your graphx look better is because of the AA and AF. All the rest is just allowing you to get in Vsync. And if you would know what you were talking about, which you are not, you would know that for what you suggest you need a good PC

[Guest]

I diagree about the Win98 comp mode not being benefitial. People with just have to try it out and see for themselves.

If turning off the framelimiter does nothing for you, then you must have a dog ugly slow PC.

It's not just because of the AA and AF, read the whole post.

VSync was only a small part. With a high refresh rate VSync is not even that important.

I do know what I'm talking about, but obviously you don't. I'm been a computer technician for a number of years so your messing with someone who does PC's for a living.

Of course the whole post is about getting the best graphics performance from the Vice City engine. Obviously, and to even the most brazen idiot I'm sure, would realise that if display gets choppy, they will need to adjust their settings to suit their set up. Read "You may have to adjust some of the settings to suit your card and processor."

You need to read a post properly before you make ignorant replies.

[Dgtadude]

Ohh SHIT !

Damn this thing really worked for me . Some months ago i got a 256mb AGP videocard . It did improve the framerate and the graphics did not change much . But DUDE . I followed these "instructions" of yours . And i got the best graphics i have ever seen in ANY game !

here are some in-game Screenshots :

http://ucfmod.gtagaming.com/g_graphics/ (dont click "Parent Directory" or you will be linked to my mod website)

Thanx Man . , Hope this works for other people too

[Blokker_1999]

computer technician does not mean that you know about 3D. Building a PC isn't the same as developing games

The framelimiter has absolutly nothing to do with the graphx quality. It limits your framerate to save CPU and GPU power which are otherwise wasted to render useless frames.

I did not say that Win98 mode isn'ty benefitial, but it causes fucking problems with MTA, god damn you can't read.

Try to look up what Vsync means, and you will find out that it has nothing to do with screen quality but that it will limit the framerate to the vertical refreshrate of your screen. This is especially benefitial on TFT screens

[Robpol86]

i havent read all this, im in a call right now (work), but according to fraps, framelimiter limits me to 60 if i remember correctly, ill read more later on

[Gamefreek]

Well from i know turn the framelimiter off just makes the game run smoother, but the objects dont load as fast. So i dont see how that would improve the graphics quallity. The best thing to do is to close all other running programs while ur playing VC so u can get the most out of ur pc

[Guest]

Actually I do know what VSync means, since I am a programmer quite often re-drawing graphics needs to be done during VBlank so screen tearing dosn't occur. Having a high refresh rate means there is less chance a frame is drawn half way through a monitor refresh. At least it's a lot less noticable.

This is my first post on this forum so please don't assume you know my level of experience and knowledge on the subject.

Your right in saying TFT screens work better with VSync as they generally don't have the higher refresh rates CRT monitors have.

I know what framelimiter is and how it works. And you reakon a better framerate dosn't impove graphics quality? Well it does in my opinion. It looks better therefore the quality has impoved.

Dgtadude: NP glad it worked for you. I was stoked when I got VC looking the way I did, so I had to post the way I did it here.

[Robpol86]

more framerates WONT imcrease quality. thats impossible. quality is something very different than how many frames a second ur card can do. u can have outstanding quality and horrible framerates. or u can have horrible quality and amazing framerates... how... winefunweut !?!?!?!?! how can u get more quality w/ more framerates/!?!?!?1/1/1/

you boggle my mind

[Guest]

Ok, were talking chalk and cheese here.. Graphics quality if your talking about texture quality, AA, AF, 32-bit colour whatever. But you could say without getting too pedantic about the matter that the quality of the game improves with higher frame rates. Using the word quality is a pretty general term, but your right generaly people refer to quality when they talk about colour depth and texture quality or the number of polygons.

It's a grey area, like does a higher resolution improve image quality? I say it does, but you could say - well you have the same colour depth and texture quality there just more pixels onscreen.

Anyway I don't really want to get into a heated debate on the schematics of proper use in 3d graphics terminology. Were heading way off topic here.

Anyway my apologies if I've upset any of the staff, developers or moderators here. I fucking love MTA and respect you guys big time.

Peace out!

[Blokker_1999]

ur title clearly states graphx, not overall quality, And you don't see a difference between 60 frames (with framelimiter) or 120 frames, anyone who says he does see a difference is lying, the naked eye only sees 24 images per second. The reason the framelimiter limits at 60 is to compensate for drops in framerate.

[Guest]

This is the last time I start a debate about graphics with a bunch of coders

Actually I believe there is a difference between 60 frames and 120 fps all you have to do is pan quickly in a FPS (EDIT: First Person Shooter) with the mouse to see that at 60 fps you get choppy movement and at 120 fps it's smoother.

NTSC works at 25 fps and PAL works at 30 fps, but video and TV don't require the high framerates like games do since there is alot less movement going on between frames. Move a video camera quickly and you will see it looks jittery. Since alot of redrawing is required in a FPS when one moves suddenly or quickly the higher the framerate the better it looks.

Without doing a google search and being totally wanky about all this, when you say the naked eye only sees 24 images per second is probably true (why else would NTSC be only 25 fps?), but if you consider the jump from drawing 24 fps to 60 frames a second the human eye will be registering the dropped frames or the "pause" between redrawing a frame. Hard to explain really, but if you were right then why wouldn't all games just run at 24 fps?

Edited December 20, 2003 by Guest

[Si|ent]

Blokker said:

..the naked eye only sees 24 images per second.

Actually blokker thats the minimum FPS that will fool the brain into seeing unbroken motion (hence why it is used in cinema, it was the least they could get away with, therefore saving on material costs. Less film needed = less outlay)) The eye and brain is capable of differentiating between 24 and much higher framerates, resulting in much smoother motion and less eyestrain. And i agree, we are drifting off topic, so tell me how to get 150fps on this steam powered pile of crap I call a P.C please

[Blokker_1999]

well, what i meant was that 24 fps looks smooth to the eye, why higher fps? as i told you : to compensate for framerate drops. When there is litle action and all of a sudden something happens like a car that explodes, the framerate of ur game drops and you will notice it. This is also the effect you are talking about with ur suddon moves. Try cruising in VC along a street with 30 fps or 90 fps without any action happening (on an empty mta server e.g.) and you will not see any difference. This is also where Vsync comes in on TFT screens. a TFT screen shows a lotless frames than a crt, a response time of 25 allows for aboutm of 40 to 50 frames per second to be drawn on the screen. Vsync will make sure that not to many frames get lost so that it can always draw a new frame when it needs to.

[Guest]

I get what your saying now Blokker, but the thing is, why would there be less frames dropping by cranking up the FPS? Surely the GPU will always try to keep up with the desired FPS. So if I have my game set to 24 FPS, that would mean there would be no difference if I ran my game at 120 FPS. But there is a difference. Why would my GPU be under more strain when an explosion happens running on 24 FPS compared to 120 FPS.

It runs better on 120 FPS and you can see the difference. I doubt the software drops frames on a percentage of the FPS. It works to the fastest it can in the desired framerate/resolution etc. The thing is 24 FPS is not enough to draw all the slight changes in a sudden move.

Anyways lets just agree to disagree on this. Unless we get a total expert on here we are merely assuming with what we know.

Interesting discussion tho.

[SteadVéx]

I just read this whole thread and couldn't help but grin a little, but in my humble opinion, no i'm not a grahpics expert, nor experianced computer techinican, although i do know, that my budget radeon 9200 does an amazing job with vc, alrite i can't put up anti alaising and what not to full and still be playable, but i think thats more cuz my computer is outdated

and there is a reason games use a lower refresh rate, its not just radeon cards, all cards do it, although i don't think it really applies anymore since most monitors support high refresh rates, i can only put my monitors up to 72 but thats because i'm cheap and don't see the point in buying a ferrari to drive to work in whilst my normal and efficant car does a much better job for less!

i think i'm a little off topic here, but just because someone has years of experiance dosen't mean they know what there on about, many times i've bought stuff, not just for computers or cars, and i know what i want, but they try to convince me i don't know what i want, but what i infact what is what they would buy

Whilst i'm going off on one, how is this improving the 'outdated' vc engine? i think bloker stated earlier that the only reason the graphics lok better is because u force the use of smoothing with the video card, which will often make game feel laggy (soz for this negative attiute, but i must admit i thought bloker was right with that thing about human eye, although i thought it was 30, i think i 've just been reading all the argumentative posts and finally had to post one )

[Si|ent]

As i said, 24fps is around the minimum that the human eye can be fooled into thinking is fluid motion (although this in mediums with 'blur' that vastly decrease the needed fps, unlike the pc which is sharp and crisp, unless your monitor is buggered (another reason less fps is needed in LCD monitors, they blurr more than a sausage in a gutter being stared at by a drunk at closing time))

For a more indepth explanation see:

http://www.100fps.com/how_many_frames_c ... ns_see.htm

[Coolnat2004]

ermm..for people like me who own a shitty integrated card, follow these for best performance (and my performance it still shitty )

1) Set in-game resolution to 640 x 480 x 16

2) Turn on the frame Limiter

3) (Only on GTA3) Turn off Frame Sync

4) Lower the draw distance to 3 or 4 notches, do what you can live with.

5) Close any unnescerry [cant spell] Programs/Processes that are running. Don't shut down explorer because some one told me that it manages your memory usage or something similar..

That should about do it..if you have a shitty card like me, and I usually get 22 or lower fps, heh. But once I turned off the frame limiter and got 40 fps once and a while, nice looking, but it slowed down the game a LOT when i was moving fast..

[Guest]

About TV - NTSC only has a 30fps signal (29.97 actually) but it displays at 60fps (PAL - same story, 25fps shows at 50). How? Ill use NTsc for this thing. Each frame is introlaced (the even numbered lines are from the first frame, and the odd numbered lines are from the second frame.) The tv shows the even lines, than the odd lines, than the next frames even lines, etc. Thus - the shaking effect on standart TVs (not too noticable). U can usually see it on the sharp edges of text, ect.

Ive just read the whole thread and wanned to join in . BTW ive read somewhere that the fps limit is 35fps on vice city (ive tested it too with Fraps) Fraps is an App to measure ur D3d and Ogl (and some overlays too) fps. Hope this clears up some things. Also the guy that has the Radeon 9200 - Antialasing is not worth it un less u have like a 3.2 ghz CPU or more, lol. AA drops fps almost 2 times less (4x AA that is) on Radeon 8500-9200 / Pro. I have a Radeon 9000 Pro and its a great card for vice city (BTW its better than the 9200 heheheh ) Peace

[Ransom]

Funny how you continue to debate with blokker (even when robpol and mrbump chime in) as they are all extremely smart with computers

[b0b0]

ur title clearly states graphx, not overall quality, And you don't see a difference between 60 frames (with framelimiter) or 120 frames, anyone who says he does see a difference is lying, the naked eye only sees 24 images per second. The reason the framelimiter limits at 60 is to compensate for drops in framerate.

Really it doesn't matter what anyone says as long as this method produces positive results. I'll definately give this a go once I get a new card. Blokker, you've been pwned. Get over it.