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Do not drop support for Windows 7/8.1

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Posted (edited)
I asked to be deleted and it hasn't happened. Since I'm depressed, unmotivated and bored, I will use this opportunity to bitch and moan about MTA Team's, in my opinion, bad decision. This is to help prevent a psychotic (?) episode (please feel pity for me!! (please feel pity for me!!)).

First up, I hate the computer/tech industry. Everyone is made to upgrade, so they can forget about what was possible using better software. If you think I'm stupid, you never went down this rabbit hole (you're uneducated) or you don't care to (you're stupid).

I'm writing this on a 2004 laptop with a low wattage CPU clocked at 1.2ghz (although as of MTA 1.2 or 1.3, it can not play anymore due to the added Shader Model 2 requirement (?)). You can STILL have an acceptable experience, even on hardware this age, it's just getting harder to do so, and there needs to be resistance.

Why on earth would you require Windows 10? Every iteration of Windows is the worst thing that has happened yet, again and again. Each uses a little more RAM, adds new requirements, and so on. Windows purely exists to raise the bar of entry, to what is considered a good computer. I will not use Windows 10.

Many people make the point "barely anyone uses this hardware anymore". Okay, would you have upgraded if there was no need to? Some software gave you that "need" to upgrade, it was probably Windows, a web browser (Chrome, Firefox) or an app based on a web browser (Discord, Teams). You wouldn't be saying this if there wasn't people like that, ruining optimization.

My 2010 laptop I play MTA on will soon not be able to do so anymore. I don't want to use Windows 10 because it sucks, I don't want to buy a new laptop because it won't have the qualities I desire, I can't use Linux because the GPU (Intel HD) driver on it has insufficient capabilities for some DirectX 9 apps (as of now).

With the discontinuation of XP I gave you the benefit of doubt, but not with this. Don't make CEF mandatory. Don't allow code of newer and newer MSVC versions. Don't make breaking changes just for the sake of bolstering the anti cheat.

In my fantasy, MTA could be compiled without anti cheat, making it fully open source. Then it could potentially be ported to compile with mingw instead, to re-acquire XP support. But that's a pipe dream.

Don't drink the Kool-Aid. Edited by Fierelier
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Posted (edited)

And in not-TLDR? An application can be written in universal code that should be secure on paper, regardless of OS. If it comes to an insecure scenario despite secure code, that's the OS' fault. But that should be no reason to artificially make the application incompatible.

I very much doubt MTA is at risk of triggering OS-specific security holes.

Edited by Fierelier
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What an opportunity for me to join the rant!

I feel your pain. I'm another person who's tired of how you "have" to buy newer and newer and more powerful stuff so that you could continue doing the same thing you have been doing all along with no problems. My most powerful computer is a laptop that I bought 10 years ago, plus I still have my Pentium 4 that I got in 2005. I could easily buy a new computer, much more powerful and all, but what's the point? I've had lots of fun on these two, and the possibilities are far from exhausted, therefore there is nothing wrong with them, and I absolutely refuse to believe otherwise. Not powerful enough to run some software? Guess what, it is software that is wrong. I'm not going to change my opinion about hardware just because someone developed some piece of bloatware. Funnily enough, the people who expect me to accept someone's arbitrary requirements as objective facts without questioning, are the same kind of people who would try to tell me how to stand up for myself and not be a pushover. Hahaha. What a bunch of nonsense.

But MTA has hardly ever been a part of this problem for me, so it looks like I'm better off than you in this regard. I'd say it's more Microsoft's fault for making more and more demanding Windows. As for MTA, it just supports the versions of Windows that are supported by Microsoft, which makes sense - although it depends on how you look at it, which I guess is the point of this topic.

But I wonder what's wrong with your graphics drivers on Linux. Does MTA not work at all or does it just run poorly? Yesterday I managed to start MTA SA 1.5.9 on that Pentium 4 under Arch Linux 32. It supports OpenGL 1.4 using Mesa i915 driver (or OpenGL 2.1 with some non-default settings, but it may be bad for performance). It was far from playable and had some visual glitches, but it ran. Perhaps could be improved with some settings, because I think I had GTA SA in general run faster in 2011-2013 than it does now - not sure if I can trust my memories, but it doesn't look believable that I could develop the NPC traffic resource and record some MTA videos while lagging that much. As for my laptop, it has Intel HD 2000 (supports OpenGL 3.3) and runs well enough. So it would be surprising to me if your Intel HD from 2010 couldn't run MTA on Linux at all. Without knowing the details, I would expect it to run and be playable at least. Or almost playable, depending on your threshold of "playable" and the server.

That said, I do like the idea of MTA keeping support for systems it currently supports, or even supporting XP again. It sounds attractive to be able to run MTA under the same configuration I did in 2008. But as far as OS is concerned, this wouldn't make a practical difference for me because I switched to Linux long ago. So while I do more or less support your position on this matter, I can't personally request the same thing from MTA developers. I mean it doesn't make much sense for me to ask for something that I know I'm very unlikely to make use of.

I agree with your notion of universal code that just does what it's supposed to do regardless of environment where it's running. When I write code, I try to make it do its own thing correctly, and depend as little as possible on platform or library specific stuff. But I can't speak for MTA because MTA is not a standalone program, it inherently depends on GTA. Meaning there's lots interaction with some particular executable, in ways defined by Windows and inherently less room for just doing its own thing.

In the end, it's nice to know I'm not the only one dissatisfied with this trend of more and more demanding software and thinks there needs to be some resistance. I've just kept MTA out of this because it has been "good enough" for me.

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